Council gets man fired for complaining?
Regular readers may remember that back in July we wrote a tale about contacting the Council. The resident in question is from Thamesmead and is sick to the back teeth of the way the Council fails to manage the are in terms of street cleaning, and cutting the grass (which, as the picture is even more bonkers that our work experience lad's garden).The resident has consistently complained to the Council almost of a daily basis about the fact that no one ever replies to him, and nothing ever gets done. He just contacted us to tell us that actually, the Council has done something, they've got him fired from his job for sending complaining emails that they find "offensive".
We have received all those emails ourselves, and whilst the resident is certainly angry, they were not offensive in our view and all the Council had to do was reply to him and actually sort out the problems he has talked about over a long period of time to resolve the issue.
It turns out, according to the resident, that he went to work yesterday and he says he was informed that he would no longer be employed because the Council had complained to the company after he had used his work email to send the mail.
He says the company also told them that because it was involved in projects with Greenwich Council in Woolwich and the 2012 Olympic work, it was not good to have an employee causing them problems. We find ourselves wondering if the Council may have threatened to pull out working with the company forcing it into a corner?
Perhaps the lesson here is don't complain too much or they will try to get you? And especially don;t use your work email to do it? And some readers wonder why we made this site anonymous? Should any members of the press wish to know more about this tale then just email us and we'll be happy to furnish them with more details for them.
posted by greenwich.watch at 10:57 am
29 Comments:
Does his employer have an IT/email policy and has (a) said ex-employee been made aware of it and (b) signed to show that, and (c) is it practised?
Also any firm who sacks soeone must follow the new statutory disputes procedure, which means 24 hours notice in writing of an offense/discplinary, with all details given in advance.
An investigation meeting must be held beforehand to ascertain both sides of the situation.
From what you have said he has a case to be heard by an ET and wrongful dismissal has no service requirement.
Can we have the name of the company that fired the man - I dont want to be unwittingly giving them my custom.
That's really crappy.
I met my local councilor (purely by chance) while i was on holiday and we've agreed to go for a drink some time soon. If you let me know slightly more detail i'll start bending his ear about this.
There is a lesson to be learnt here. Dont use your employers IT for personal business. The employee should have used his own time and own equipment to send any personal correspondance.
the lesson to be learned here is that if your staff do unpaid overtime ( who dosen't) and if your staff recive and make business call on mobiles they pay for (dito) treating them with a measure of respect will keep you out of the industrial tribunal.
Its disheartening that someone who obviously cares about their environment is not allowed to complain that it is not cared for.
So are we just supposed to pay our council tax and put up with whatever service they feel they want to provide us?
I feel that I have to respond to
`anonymous` comment, posted at 10.22pm.
Has he/she never used any of their Employers IT equipment for personal
correspondence?
Actually thinking more about his/her comment, it appears that they are not very IT minded as they have managed to spell correspondEnce wrong.
So maybe they have never used thier Employers IT equipment?
I've spoken to someone who knows who this guy is. He has only given you half the facts.
Firstly he was a contract worker and was going to be released shortly anyway mainly due to his average ability and complaining nature. He was wasting company time sending numerous emails that were not very pleasant with the companys logo at the bottom of each email. His previous 2 employers would not re-employ him due to his unhelpful complaining nature. He may have a greivance with the council but there are more professional ways of going about it..
Is it possible to post up the sort of things he said that the council deemed "offensive"?
That way it's clear to all to see whether the Council does have some ground to stand on (cough, yeah I know) or if they really have overreacted and silenced a complainer.
In response to anonymous (7.51pm),
I also know this guy, and I know also for a fact that all the Senior Engineers & Associates he worked for at this Company were more than happy with his standard of work and his ability to produce drawings on time and to programme, and his ability to liase with them directly to achieve these deadlines.
So my friend, are you saying that all these Senior Engineers & Associates were not being honest?
Therefore, if this is what you consider to be `Average Ability',then my friend you are `having a pop' at a great number of the working population.
Maybe your particular `Ability' is very high, but you should not make comments like this without all the facts.
Further more, below is copy of E-Mail from this guys Manager (sent on 14/09/07), so if as you state `this guy was to be released shortly', then why would a Manager send such an E-Mail?
`As you were told the decision about your rate increase was in hand and would have been made following six months service (17/09/07) unfortunately this matter has now made that decision superfluous'.
As for the E-Mails `not being very pleasant' comment, have you actually seen them?
If you have, then how comes?
These E-Mails were intended for Greenwich Council only, plus of course the copies Greenwich Council sent to this guys ex company.
Has someone given you copies?
To friend of mr complainer - you must be a very close friend as I have been informed that you seem to adopt the same argumentative tone as he does in your responses.
Senior Engineers and Associates were more than happy with his work? - My friend doubts that very much - has he proof of this?
Apparently his work was satisfactory but his attitude wasn't. The company was very tolerant in keeping him on so long.
They wouldnt want him back and nor would many of his previous employers. He actually gives fellow contract workers a bad name.
He gives the impression that he was an employee of the company - he
was a contract worker - different rules apply.
Rather strange that he didn't get a rate increase while he was there while others around him did, but he was told he would have got one now he's no longer working there!
Unpleasant emails? - let us all be the judge. Post 'em up for all to see, not just select ones, but the whole lot - I've been informed there are quite a lot of them, all done on the companies time...
Can we have the name of the complainer that got fired - I don't want to unwittingly give him a job...
Just a quick note to all who have requested more information/details.
We suggest that you pick up a copy of the `Bexley Times` tomorrow.
Also, by the way, latest ground breaking news that Greenwich Council are now denying sending/making a complaint.
Still, no news there, as this is what we have come to expect of our wonderful council?
Bad news people.........
We have just been informed by the Bexley Extra that they will not be running this story.
Apparently, it now appears that both this guys Ex. Employers Director and Greenwich Council are denying receiving/making/sending a complaint.
It is now just his word against theirs.
We just ask the question,
`Who do you really believe`!!!!!!!
Seems to be a dangerous principal to believe anything told to you just because you have a poor opinion of the Council. Any outrageous allegation will be believed, rather than the fact that sometimes nutters exist who make up things (surely not?)!!!!
Surely it is a dangerous principal to believe anything that is alleged just because you have a poor opinion of the Council?
Is it not possible that there are nutters out there who have nothing better to do than blame others for anything that goes wrong in thier lives?!!!
Oh dear, are the liberal masses getting their knickers in a twist over a thief?
Lets not forget, if he used his employers equipment without their permission and / or did it on company time, then he is a thief. Shame we don't cut thieves hands off because I am sure this would 'cut' petty pilfering of this nature!
Also, if he wanted to raise any issue with the Council, why didnt he do it using his own personal equipment or even pop into a Greenwich Library and use their free internet service? Now that would be ironic!
Maybe he will learn not to steal from his employer? Maybe this experience will make him a better employee in the future?
I support his employer for making the right decision. I can't abide thieves, be them white collar types or be them hoodie types mugging an old woman.
I believe them - this guy sounds like a right moaner...
It's irrelevant that he was dismissed for harassing the council.
If he was abusing the company email system by harassing any company or anybody then they were right to dismiss him..
Apparently the company did not receive a complaint direct from the council. It was from a private yahoo address. Maybe it was from a fed up employee of the council - who knows for sure....
The extract below is from Greenwich Council's web site. This is the official way to file a complaint you have with them.
How to complain about a service
You will find a six-step guide to the complaints process below. You can contact the Council’s Chief Executive, your Councillor or Member of Parliament at any stage of this process for advice or help.
Step one: contact the service directly
If you want to comment or complain about a particular Council service, you should contact the service directly in the first instance. Please see our A-Z of services to find the service that you wish to complain about. Those links will take you to contact details for providers of that service.
If the problem is not resolved to your satisfaction, move to Step Two:
Step two: make a formal complaint
You can either:
complain directly to a particular Council department, or
complete one of our Customer Complaints forms.
Step three: what do we do about your formal complaint?
We will try to confirm that we have received your complaint within five working days.
We will forward your complaint to the manager of the service concerned.
The manager will normally send you a full written reply within 15 working days of getting your complaint.
Step four: if you are not happy with your reply
If you are not happy with your reply, you can contact the Complaints Officer for the relevant service
The Complaints Officer will:
Confirm that they have received your complaint within five working days.
Arrange for your complaint to be considered by a more senior member of staff. You will be given their name and they will normally send you a full written reply within 20 working days.
Step five: if you are unhappy with the second response to your formal complaint
The Complaints Officer will tell you how you can appeal to the Chief Executive of Greenwich Council. You should appeal within four weeks of receiving the second response to your complaint.
The Chief Executive will investigate your complaint for a final time. You will be informed that the Chief Executive has received your complaint within five working days.
The Chief Executive will normally send you a full written reply within 30 working days.
Step six: if you are still unhappy with your reply
You can complain to your the Local Government Ombudsman.
We should like to point out that the majority of the above anonymous comments were made using Council computers.
We should also point out that we've seen an email where the HR of the company in question said the Council had complained to them. So it's not a case of us believing any old nutter.
At last, ACTION FROM THE COUNCIL!!!!!!!!!!!
What a great pity though that the issues raised months ago, with their various departments, still exist.
i.e 1) Grass still un-cut after 7 months.
2) Loads of rubbish still on Grass Verges.
3) Numerous shards & large pieces of glass,(from the burnt out car) still littering the Public Footpath and therefore creating a `Health & Safety` hazard, even after 6 months.
But, hold up, dont the Council state on their own web-site that `anything which is likely to cause a Health & Safety issue`, is dealt with within 24 hours?
Now surely, Greenwich Council cannot be saying something like this and actually not complying with it.
Can they?
Perhaps these `Council Computers` will now actually do something about the problems?
Also, is it not a crime for these `council computers` to make certain of these comments (in particular the issue about the Complaint to this guys company),
when quite honestly they `have not got a clue`, as to what was actually sent/written/received between `another council computer` and this guys company?
NO!!!!!!,
I cannot believe that certain employees of our wonderfully glorious Greenwich Council (yes, thats right I am having a laugh at them) have been using their Companys IT Equipment (which I might add, has most probably been brought & paid for by you and me, through our taxes) for sending personal E-Mails.
Not only that they also manage to get the facts wrong. (Still no change there).
Not only does this further prove the Double Standard`ish way that they operate, but it also shows the `anonymous` comments above from `Council Computers`, to be the thieves that they are.!!!!!!!!!!!!
(Yes `Council Computers`, you did start the insults).
Not only do they `rob` Council Tax Money from you, on the promise of providing a service (yes that is another joke at them), they also waste tax payers money carrying out their Personal Business on company IT Equipment.
So if they were suggesting that this `guys` hands should be cut off for using his Company E-Mail, then my friends what should we do with these thieves?
Please, oh please Greenwich Council just stick to what you do best, Yes that is correct, hardly anything.
If you have an email from the company as you so claim - why not post it...
You're not normally so slow at exposing "information" you get about the council - so why not do the same thing here
Where is the evidence that any of the postings in this string come from council computers?
Didn't you report some time ago that council employees can't access this website as it has been blocked by their IT department?
Is Greenwich Watch attempting to mislead readers with misinformation to make the blog more interesting and create a conspiracy where none exists?
Maybe Greenwich watch just doesn't like that the real story is that someone who was stealing from his employer got sacked.
I wonder, do you maintain this blog in your employers’ time?
Without transparency there is no honesty. You write this blog and yet choose to hide your identity.
What is your agenda? Are you a scaremonger, maybe an ex council employee who was sacked and feels hard done by, could it be that you are politically motivated?
Should this blog be renamed Greenwich Fibber?
Where is the evidence?: Tracking logs.
Council employees blocked?: Actually we reported that we'd been told that we were banned, and that an IT solution to enforce it was being implemented.
Conspiracy?: No, that would just be silly.
Real story stealing: Actually we don't like the fact that the Council interfered in a private company where the person was merely complaining. We're also not hysterical sorts that consider it "stealing".
Do we do this on employers time?: Absolutely. We're the boss of our own company.
Why anonymous: We write this blog anonymously because we have no desire to be locally famous, nor do we want to be assaulted by certain members of the council that occasionally grow Hitler mustaches and who have a tendency to throw computers around.
What is the agenda?: Totally negative against the Council. We're sick of them. Mainly we're sick of the near-corruption that occurs at the top.
He wasn't 'mereley complaining' - he was emailing several times a day over a period of a few months
which I would call harrassment and abuse of the company's email...
Actually he was sending the same text every day but simply changing the date and number of days it had taken for the Council not to respond to him and the vast majority of the emails were sent from his personal email address with Tiscali.
We did chuckle at the idea that someone can harass an institution though. We'd better watch it!
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